My father’s official cause of death was prostate cancer. He was 97 1/2. He knew he had it for years before his death and refused treatment. He’s always been my role model.
My great uncle got the diagnosis of prostate cancer at 65. His old school doctor said there's no need to mess with it, something else will get you first. Twenty years later his old doctor had retired and his bright young replacement insisted on aggressive treatment. Two years later my uncle was dead. So basically all that aggressive and extremely unpleasant treatment just made his last two years on earth living hell.
I assume that the same may be true for colorectal cancers. Recently, my husband and I received 2 free "screening" kits for this from BC/BS. We got a letter admonishing us for not returning the kits. Why the pressure from insurance companies, if they're concerned about payouts for treatment? They aren't. Their income stream comes from our premiums, sure; but they must be getting a boatload of kick-backs from pharma and other financially interested parties. Maybe they're paid to collect our DNA and other info from these tests. It's all on the table, as far as I'm concerned.
Good question. The medical industrial complex has tentacles that keep the cash cow they all milk in the mutual barn. This includes a network of health care alliances of not just pharmaceutical and prosthetics manufacturers but healthcare providers who are largely trained in institutions bought and sold into this insidious industry. Anyone who bucks or challenges the “standards” set by these bedfellows becomes a pariah, ousted and discredited by the flock. Even when they have previously established and respected positions within the healthcare industry at large. When profits outweigh real science and effective healthcare greed and avarice become the navigators and captains.
Thank you Dr Malone, for bringing yet another ongoing travesty in healthcare to light. Wish there were more men of courage step up and speak truth to lies.
Just like the 78% false positives from PSA tests, I discovered that these colon screening tests have something like a 90% false positive rate for folks having hemorrhoids.
Those kits will screen for blood present in the stool. Particularly non-fresh, that could be an indication something is not right in the digestive system. COLON CANCER is not fun AT ALL, but preventable by removing cancerous polyps on time.
I am not a doctor and don't have any conflict of interest. Just experience from a country where preventive medicine like PSA and screening kits are not for the masses.
For 24 years my primary care docs said I had an enlarged prostate. The PSA test was a standard and was done every year. The time i hit 6 the doc recommended a biopsy. I said no, found a supplement that brought me down to 2 or less over the years. At 87 I stay away from the doc as much as possible. Quit my blood pressure meds and again take supplements that help control it. Feel so much better that I go to the gym three days a week and work on weights. Have lost weight and my knees are getting stronger. So, a person should do their own exploring and above all stay physically active.
Hey Robert, great post and glad to hear it. Trying to convince wife to get off her BP meds as her BP is not elevated excessively but have not been able to find a supplement that can equal the small drop her meds provide in BP. any recommendations?
also, interested in similar meds for reducing PSA number. My last one was 7+. . .
I'd encourage concerned people to read Paul Marik's book on Cancer Care. The FLCCC is also running a cancer treatment trila which includes much safer conservative treatment for prostae cancer. t's become evident that ivermectin and fenbendazole, both much safer than radical prostatectomy and radiation, may offer alternatives that until recently were unrecognized treatments for prostate cancer.
Was watching an FLCCC presentation with Dr Marik last evening. There is a second edition of his cancer book. The print copy is in the works. I think he indicated a Kindle copy is available. Due to public outcry his book(s?) are again available at Amazon. A download may be available from the FLCCC. Always worth checking.
In 1984 my father was diagnosed with prostate cancer. He was a smoker and I’m sure that didn’t help what happened to him. I was only 19 I believe when he was diagnosed so I didn’t know a lot of how things took place with him, but I often wonder if he had symptoms for years and didn’t say anything. Not long after being diagnosed they found the cancer had metastasized into his bones. I can’t tell you how excruciating it is to see how bone cancer slowly over time kills your loved one, it is a terrible and painful cancer. Little by little over about a year my father kept losing weight and eventually succumbed to the bone cancer. I remember my mother had in her own way forced him to quit smoking and at one point my father nearly begged for a cigarette and she said no. Later my mother told me how much she regretted not letting him smoke. I always pray they are both together now, and hope someday we’ll all be together again
I told her don’t dwell on that, my father loved my mother with all his heart and always stood behind har as they raised us 4. I was very lucky to have them both.
Sorry for you loss. A study they will never do. Test prostate cancer patients for Vitamin D blood level. There is a correlation that would prove low D is a mitigating factor. If everyone had a blood value of D over 50 ng's we would cut healthcare costs in half. Oops! Doesn't grow the medical institutions that are taking almost $1 out of $5 from the economy. My cousin called me and said he had only 3 months to live. Diagnosed with PC. Lost track of him and he called me 10 years later. George I thought you died. No! Been taking 10,000 iu's of vitamin D daily. George it is POISON! I was told like all the physicians and pharmacists for 50 years that taking more than 1000 iu's daily was poisonous. Some where in the medical text books they conveniently dropped the notation that more than 1,000 iu's per KILOGRAM was the issue. Average person weighs 62 kilograms! Because of sun avoidance, lack of D in food products including eggs, etc. the average US citizen is deficient and averages around 25 ng's. Half of what the minimum blood value should be. I beat Covid without drugs and am in the high risk category because of age. My blood value is 70 ng's. I doubt I would be here if I had only 20 ng's in blood value of the active form which is a hormone controlling about 3000 gene expressions. I woke up to this when I went to my first seminar in 2010 by www.grassrootshealth.net. Medicine man knows this and ignores the truth and discredits D continually. I wonder why?
Everyone here should read "Vitamin D, Vitamin C, Iodine: Why More is Better" by Doumenach, a French doctor. It is an unusual book, basically summaries of dozens of studies with his comments peppered throughout, and with recommendations for dosing and cautions. It should be required reading for every physician, and I credit it with eliminating my hypothyroidism, a common malady in my family.
Thomas, thanks for your comment. Back in those days I don’t think my father was out in the sun much, and for sure he wasn’t taking vitamin D supplements. Question, I’m out in the sun and weather all the time. At times I have taken vitamin D, but can you get sufficient vitamin D by being in the sun a lot? Or should you still take supplements?
Depends on skin tone and how sensitive to sun exposure! Also time of day. Max at noon. I take 125 mg daily to maintain 70 ng’s of blood value. Kidney and liver function needs to be OK. Lot’s of variables. If having an issue boosting above 50 ng’s find physician that understands true value of D.
My brother at 76 had a PSA of 9! The urologist suggested he have radiation pellets inserted in the prostate. In turn, second opinion at Mayo said he would die of something else before the prostate would do him in. Correct diagnosis. Myself had a PSA of 9 and the diagnosis was correct that it was an infection that needed to be addressed. My son had a PSA of 72 and it returned to normal. He embraced all the RNA injections (at least 3). Again, patient and dietary changes worked. Unfortunately, pushing PSA testing and aggressively attacking the problem causes more harm than good. A friend had the pellets and it burned through the urethra and changed how he urinated. The urologists need to be open and up front with the risks involved.
Thanks for this article. As a man who will be 74 in February. I also face the possibilities of prostate cancer. I learned over the years that a large percentage of elderly men live with prostate cancer and it is not what they die from. Maybe it is just another metabolic stress on the ageing body. I have had PSA tests in checkups but all showed negative. I refused to take the Covid jabs and am glad I did. Trust in much of the medical system is broken because of what those paying attention have learned in the last 4 years. I have a friend who's mother never went to a doctor until she was 93 and she was finally having problems. She was quickly treated to death by the doctors.
Went through the whole business in 2016 and 2017. The PSA merry-go round was not something I questioned at the time. Had a radical prostatectomy in November 2017 and ended up with both primary side effects. I started with active surveillance, something which my urologist did not initially recommend but somewhat hesitantly supported as an option. That went on for 18 months while I had 2 biopsies and got tortured with the (PSA) numbers every 60 days. Looking back on the whole experience, including the ongoing PSA tests after my prostate was gone(yes you still generate very tiny PSA numbers forever), the main doubt that gradually crept into my mind was about the testing protocol and methodology. Interestingly, my post surgery tiny PSA numbers were all good for about 6 months, until they introduced a “more sensitive test” that could detect even tinier movements in my PSA scores, claiming “it’s not the absolute value of the numbers we’re interested in, it’s the rate of change”. We’re talking here about numbers down to 1/100th of a point. To calibrate that, my pre surgery PSA number had “grown” from 2.5(initial suspect exam) all the way up to 10, which is when they miraculously “found the cancer” in a biopsy with more microscopic math that seemed in hindsight like a numbers fishing expedition. Meanwhile my urologist told me he had seen PSA scores of 3,000. I was confused but living in denial because I was in the care of experts. It’s all history now.
My adoptive father’s dad died from prostate cancer. My father has a type of blood cancer now that is slow moving. My uncle started off with prostate cancer, was treated, ‘successfully’… and over the next twenty years fought off blood cancer and then it moved into his bones. He was a fighter and did every experimental treatment he could get into at either Hopkins or MD Anderson in Houston; at the end he was drinking good scotch and taking his pain killers. He and I were talking towards the end, He said he was confused "because he did everything he was supposed to do”, I told him , “sometimes it just sucks... but you are in control (of your treatment) and get to say when you’ve had enough.” He’d had enough and knew where he was going. I know I will see him on the other side of eternity.
Good article. I have a friend who had surgery several years ago which has been a problem ever since for him. Now, he has Parkinson’s and that is what will take him out. His wife is his sweet caregiver. It’s a different type (Lewy body) dementia.
My own husband had a for real problem which caused the worst UTI/sepsis I ever saw in medicine. He recovered (note! Sepsis not from the vaccine) and had the new urolift procedure and done well. He is 89! It was not cancer. As a nurse, I worried for nothing. Glad I heeded the first person’s advice based on his outcome.
My father had old man’s prostate cancer. Slow moving. They gave him testosterone blockers and had terrible hot flashes. He died of a stroke. My brother has fast moving prostate cancer. He has had it close to 20 years. He went to a cancer center in Germany. They used heat therapy to zap the prostate or tumor. He did that treatment 2 times. Well his cancer is back and moved to his bladder. It has been this way for sometime but thanks to the vax he has diabetes. The drs say he has Alzheimer’s. His urologist is surprised he is still a live. He is taking some high powered vitamins. He has a stint in his urethra . He is my oldest sibling. Everyone else in my family has passed. I agree the PSA test should not be the standard for identifying prostrate cancer.
You may or may not have an answer for this. Coincidentally, I have just diagnosed a dog patient of mine with what appears to be prostatic carcinoma(NOT via PSA, via cytology). I would love to try some alternative, less expensive options for my veterinary patients than $10,000 referral to specialist for radiation and chemo.
Is anyone doing work with fenbendazole and/or ivermectin(both of which I keep on hand for parasites) and prostate cancer? Surgery is almost never an option with dogs.
Ya’know, if it weren’t for all those nerves cruising thru the prostate this wouldn’t be such a big deal, perhaps similar to having your appendix removed. We, guys (sorry, I’m vey jealous of the XY designation so I’m excluding some confused dos equis), might be disturbed by a lack of fluid during orgasm-ejaculation but as long as we can manage an AM salute when it’s appropriate to thus salute, I know I wouldn’t be bothered. But this is a cruel joke: we’re living longer, most of us are past the urge to reproduce yet a potential cancer that would be rarely seen a hundred years ago is now in the back of most men’s minds of a certain age. And it’s not so much removing the prostate it’s what removing the prostate so often leads to - dis-salutation. [yeah, don’t know if that’s a word but I think you get the point, even if it’s a flaccid point 😆 sorry. Not]
I'll comment on the other side. I got the PSA test and scored high. I obtained a biopsy and the prostate was found to be cancerous. Prostate was removed with the sac intact. That was 17 years ago. There was apparently no metastasis.
My father’s official cause of death was prostate cancer. He was 97 1/2. He knew he had it for years before his death and refused treatment. He’s always been my role model.
My great uncle got the diagnosis of prostate cancer at 65. His old school doctor said there's no need to mess with it, something else will get you first. Twenty years later his old doctor had retired and his bright young replacement insisted on aggressive treatment. Two years later my uncle was dead. So basically all that aggressive and extremely unpleasant treatment just made his last two years on earth living hell.
Yea! The medicine man too often creates purgatory on earth!
You're father chose, wisely.
I assume that the same may be true for colorectal cancers. Recently, my husband and I received 2 free "screening" kits for this from BC/BS. We got a letter admonishing us for not returning the kits. Why the pressure from insurance companies, if they're concerned about payouts for treatment? They aren't. Their income stream comes from our premiums, sure; but they must be getting a boatload of kick-backs from pharma and other financially interested parties. Maybe they're paid to collect our DNA and other info from these tests. It's all on the table, as far as I'm concerned.
Good question. The medical industrial complex has tentacles that keep the cash cow they all milk in the mutual barn. This includes a network of health care alliances of not just pharmaceutical and prosthetics manufacturers but healthcare providers who are largely trained in institutions bought and sold into this insidious industry. Anyone who bucks or challenges the “standards” set by these bedfellows becomes a pariah, ousted and discredited by the flock. Even when they have previously established and respected positions within the healthcare industry at large. When profits outweigh real science and effective healthcare greed and avarice become the navigators and captains.
Thank you Dr Malone, for bringing yet another ongoing travesty in healthcare to light. Wish there were more men of courage step up and speak truth to lies.
Just like the 78% false positives from PSA tests, I discovered that these colon screening tests have something like a 90% false positive rate for folks having hemorrhoids.
Those kits will screen for blood present in the stool. Particularly non-fresh, that could be an indication something is not right in the digestive system. COLON CANCER is not fun AT ALL, but preventable by removing cancerous polyps on time.
I am not a doctor and don't have any conflict of interest. Just experience from a country where preventive medicine like PSA and screening kits are not for the masses.
For 24 years my primary care docs said I had an enlarged prostate. The PSA test was a standard and was done every year. The time i hit 6 the doc recommended a biopsy. I said no, found a supplement that brought me down to 2 or less over the years. At 87 I stay away from the doc as much as possible. Quit my blood pressure meds and again take supplements that help control it. Feel so much better that I go to the gym three days a week and work on weights. Have lost weight and my knees are getting stronger. So, a person should do their own exploring and above all stay physically active.
Awesome Robert!
Amen.
Hey Robert, great post and glad to hear it. Trying to convince wife to get off her BP meds as her BP is not elevated excessively but have not been able to find a supplement that can equal the small drop her meds provide in BP. any recommendations?
also, interested in similar meds for reducing PSA number. My last one was 7+. . .
Love it. Holding the current! Me too.
I'd encourage concerned people to read Paul Marik's book on Cancer Care. The FLCCC is also running a cancer treatment trila which includes much safer conservative treatment for prostae cancer. t's become evident that ivermectin and fenbendazole, both much safer than radical prostatectomy and radiation, may offer alternatives that until recently were unrecognized treatments for prostate cancer.
Was watching an FLCCC presentation with Dr Marik last evening. There is a second edition of his cancer book. The print copy is in the works. I think he indicated a Kindle copy is available. Due to public outcry his book(s?) are again available at Amazon. A download may be available from the FLCCC. Always worth checking.
Ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, and a few other might just break big pharma!
One can only hope...
Here are links to the Cancer Care books:
- FLCCC website: Downloadable FLCCC Cancer Care Monograph: https://covid19criticalcare.com/reviews-and-monographs/cancer-care/
- Amazon website (Kindle): https://www.amazon.com/Cancer-Care-Repurposed-Metabolic-Interventions-ebook/dp/B0DGXR2MV6
Yes, new options are opening regarding prevention through diet, life style, medications like ivermectin etc... and it is a good thing.
Marik is another hero. 😊
In 1984 my father was diagnosed with prostate cancer. He was a smoker and I’m sure that didn’t help what happened to him. I was only 19 I believe when he was diagnosed so I didn’t know a lot of how things took place with him, but I often wonder if he had symptoms for years and didn’t say anything. Not long after being diagnosed they found the cancer had metastasized into his bones. I can’t tell you how excruciating it is to see how bone cancer slowly over time kills your loved one, it is a terrible and painful cancer. Little by little over about a year my father kept losing weight and eventually succumbed to the bone cancer. I remember my mother had in her own way forced him to quit smoking and at one point my father nearly begged for a cigarette and she said no. Later my mother told me how much she regretted not letting him smoke. I always pray they are both together now, and hope someday we’ll all be together again
James, we JUST can't second guess TOUGH LOVE!
I'm sure that your mom 👩 was acting out of genuine love ❤️.
I told her don’t dwell on that, my father loved my mother with all his heart and always stood behind har as they raised us 4. I was very lucky to have them both.
Thank you Ana!!
Sorry for you loss. A study they will never do. Test prostate cancer patients for Vitamin D blood level. There is a correlation that would prove low D is a mitigating factor. If everyone had a blood value of D over 50 ng's we would cut healthcare costs in half. Oops! Doesn't grow the medical institutions that are taking almost $1 out of $5 from the economy. My cousin called me and said he had only 3 months to live. Diagnosed with PC. Lost track of him and he called me 10 years later. George I thought you died. No! Been taking 10,000 iu's of vitamin D daily. George it is POISON! I was told like all the physicians and pharmacists for 50 years that taking more than 1000 iu's daily was poisonous. Some where in the medical text books they conveniently dropped the notation that more than 1,000 iu's per KILOGRAM was the issue. Average person weighs 62 kilograms! Because of sun avoidance, lack of D in food products including eggs, etc. the average US citizen is deficient and averages around 25 ng's. Half of what the minimum blood value should be. I beat Covid without drugs and am in the high risk category because of age. My blood value is 70 ng's. I doubt I would be here if I had only 20 ng's in blood value of the active form which is a hormone controlling about 3000 gene expressions. I woke up to this when I went to my first seminar in 2010 by www.grassrootshealth.net. Medicine man knows this and ignores the truth and discredits D continually. I wonder why?
Everyone here should read "Vitamin D, Vitamin C, Iodine: Why More is Better" by Doumenach, a French doctor. It is an unusual book, basically summaries of dozens of studies with his comments peppered throughout, and with recommendations for dosing and cautions. It should be required reading for every physician, and I credit it with eliminating my hypothyroidism, a common malady in my family.
Thomas, thanks for your comment. Back in those days I don’t think my father was out in the sun much, and for sure he wasn’t taking vitamin D supplements. Question, I’m out in the sun and weather all the time. At times I have taken vitamin D, but can you get sufficient vitamin D by being in the sun a lot? Or should you still take supplements?
if concerned it is a simple test along with blood CBC; they can just add it on.
Unless they. . . refuse?!
Depends on skin tone and how sensitive to sun exposure! Also time of day. Max at noon. I take 125 mg daily to maintain 70 ng’s of blood value. Kidney and liver function needs to be OK. Lot’s of variables. If having an issue boosting above 50 ng’s find physician that understands true value of D.
Go to GrassrootsHealth.net
My brother at 76 had a PSA of 9! The urologist suggested he have radiation pellets inserted in the prostate. In turn, second opinion at Mayo said he would die of something else before the prostate would do him in. Correct diagnosis. Myself had a PSA of 9 and the diagnosis was correct that it was an infection that needed to be addressed. My son had a PSA of 72 and it returned to normal. He embraced all the RNA injections (at least 3). Again, patient and dietary changes worked. Unfortunately, pushing PSA testing and aggressively attacking the problem causes more harm than good. A friend had the pellets and it burned through the urethra and changed how he urinated. The urologists need to be open and up front with the risks involved.
"... urologists need to be up front ... "
Good one, Dr. Braun
Thanks for this article. As a man who will be 74 in February. I also face the possibilities of prostate cancer. I learned over the years that a large percentage of elderly men live with prostate cancer and it is not what they die from. Maybe it is just another metabolic stress on the ageing body. I have had PSA tests in checkups but all showed negative. I refused to take the Covid jabs and am glad I did. Trust in much of the medical system is broken because of what those paying attention have learned in the last 4 years. I have a friend who's mother never went to a doctor until she was 93 and she was finally having problems. She was quickly treated to death by the doctors.
"As a man who will be 74 in February", hey! me too!,
Go class of '69!
Went through the whole business in 2016 and 2017. The PSA merry-go round was not something I questioned at the time. Had a radical prostatectomy in November 2017 and ended up with both primary side effects. I started with active surveillance, something which my urologist did not initially recommend but somewhat hesitantly supported as an option. That went on for 18 months while I had 2 biopsies and got tortured with the (PSA) numbers every 60 days. Looking back on the whole experience, including the ongoing PSA tests after my prostate was gone(yes you still generate very tiny PSA numbers forever), the main doubt that gradually crept into my mind was about the testing protocol and methodology. Interestingly, my post surgery tiny PSA numbers were all good for about 6 months, until they introduced a “more sensitive test” that could detect even tinier movements in my PSA scores, claiming “it’s not the absolute value of the numbers we’re interested in, it’s the rate of change”. We’re talking here about numbers down to 1/100th of a point. To calibrate that, my pre surgery PSA number had “grown” from 2.5(initial suspect exam) all the way up to 10, which is when they miraculously “found the cancer” in a biopsy with more microscopic math that seemed in hindsight like a numbers fishing expedition. Meanwhile my urologist told me he had seen PSA scores of 3,000. I was confused but living in denial because I was in the care of experts. It’s all history now.
Holy crapp.
Biopsies are another issue. There is an area that they can't get to. So a negative biopsy doesn't mean you are clear.
My adoptive father’s dad died from prostate cancer. My father has a type of blood cancer now that is slow moving. My uncle started off with prostate cancer, was treated, ‘successfully’… and over the next twenty years fought off blood cancer and then it moved into his bones. He was a fighter and did every experimental treatment he could get into at either Hopkins or MD Anderson in Houston; at the end he was drinking good scotch and taking his pain killers. He and I were talking towards the end, He said he was confused "because he did everything he was supposed to do”, I told him , “sometimes it just sucks... but you are in control (of your treatment) and get to say when you’ve had enough.” He’d had enough and knew where he was going. I know I will see him on the other side of eternity.
Good article. I have a friend who had surgery several years ago which has been a problem ever since for him. Now, he has Parkinson’s and that is what will take him out. His wife is his sweet caregiver. It’s a different type (Lewy body) dementia.
My own husband had a for real problem which caused the worst UTI/sepsis I ever saw in medicine. He recovered (note! Sepsis not from the vaccine) and had the new urolift procedure and done well. He is 89! It was not cancer. As a nurse, I worried for nothing. Glad I heeded the first person’s advice based on his outcome.
Thanks Dr. Malone!
This IS good news!
My father had old man’s prostate cancer. Slow moving. They gave him testosterone blockers and had terrible hot flashes. He died of a stroke. My brother has fast moving prostate cancer. He has had it close to 20 years. He went to a cancer center in Germany. They used heat therapy to zap the prostate or tumor. He did that treatment 2 times. Well his cancer is back and moved to his bladder. It has been this way for sometime but thanks to the vax he has diabetes. The drs say he has Alzheimer’s. His urologist is surprised he is still a live. He is taking some high powered vitamins. He has a stint in his urethra . He is my oldest sibling. Everyone else in my family has passed. I agree the PSA test should not be the standard for identifying prostrate cancer.
Have a great day and pray for our country.
You may or may not have an answer for this. Coincidentally, I have just diagnosed a dog patient of mine with what appears to be prostatic carcinoma(NOT via PSA, via cytology). I would love to try some alternative, less expensive options for my veterinary patients than $10,000 referral to specialist for radiation and chemo.
Is anyone doing work with fenbendazole and/or ivermectin(both of which I keep on hand for parasites) and prostate cancer? Surgery is almost never an option with dogs.
There are a couple of canine success stories on the fenbendazolecancurecancer website.
https://thehappyhealingstore.com/
Dandelion root and Chaga!
Ya’know, if it weren’t for all those nerves cruising thru the prostate this wouldn’t be such a big deal, perhaps similar to having your appendix removed. We, guys (sorry, I’m vey jealous of the XY designation so I’m excluding some confused dos equis), might be disturbed by a lack of fluid during orgasm-ejaculation but as long as we can manage an AM salute when it’s appropriate to thus salute, I know I wouldn’t be bothered. But this is a cruel joke: we’re living longer, most of us are past the urge to reproduce yet a potential cancer that would be rarely seen a hundred years ago is now in the back of most men’s minds of a certain age. And it’s not so much removing the prostate it’s what removing the prostate so often leads to - dis-salutation. [yeah, don’t know if that’s a word but I think you get the point, even if it’s a flaccid point 😆 sorry. Not]
good one!
Thank you Dr. Malone. My husband for personal reasons as well, will find this article very useful. Praying for everyone 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
I'll comment on the other side. I got the PSA test and scored high. I obtained a biopsy and the prostate was found to be cancerous. Prostate was removed with the sac intact. That was 17 years ago. There was apparently no metastasis.
I'm starting to think the Christian Scientists have it right. The entire medical profession is a scam.
I, too, have made the same statement! Always figured they were nutballs. . . now, I see it was me all that time.