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David Watson's avatar

K2 and taurine is readily available in meats, eggs and dairy. People who forgo these natural foods we were designed (evolved) to prefer should take supplements. Magnesium is a bigger problem since it has been leached out of agricultural soils by generations of industrial farming. Most people are deficient. Since vitamin D metabolism and lots of other processes require magnesium, most people are also deficient in bioavailable D, which leads to other malfunctions, like immune definpciencies that produce more serious infections from routine pathogens like sars2. Other symptoms can be heart arrhythmia and leg cramps. Carolyn Dean has written good descriptions of the magnesium problem.

I discovered while I was experimenting vegan that I was overdosing on foods high in oxalates, a chemical pretty toxic to humans but common in most plants. It's their defense mechanism. Oxalate binds to calcium and magnesium, causing all sorts of problems, but reducing the magnesium available for normal metabolic function. I ratcheted up to very high doses of magnesium without my symptoms abating until I discovered my oxalate problem. I changed my diet to reduce oxalates, my symptoms resolved, and I now take more normal doses of magnesium supplement.

We're just a bag of chemicals. It's important to keep them balanced.

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MichelleD's avatar

Could you name the sources of oxalates? (I am a lactoovovegetarian, by natural gravitation to these foods.)

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David Watson's avatar

Most plant foods have some, in varying amounts. Spinach is one of the highest, and I was eating a lot of it. Search on oxalate food and you'll find lists showing amounts.

Formally, it's oxalic acid. Oxalate is a general term for the combinations with other molecules, like magnesium and calcium. We can handle some amount, excreting it through the urine. If we consume more than the kidneys can process, especially if not drinking enough water, it gets stored as tiny sharp crystals called raphides that accumulate in kidneys (as stones), urinary tract, joints, heart, others. Docs like to prescribe meds or procedures to break them up, but it seems better just to remove the source. Not much profit in just telling us to lighten up on the spinach.

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DC Lovell's avatar

Maybe I 'm out of my depth, but are you being humorous? If so Bravo!

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MichelleD's avatar

Ha ha, no. It’s lacto ovo vegetarian. Milk products, eggs, plant foods (no meat, but not vegan).

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DC Lovell's avatar

Certain needs and seeds are a good source for Mg.

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David Watson's avatar

Plants don't make their minerals, but pull them from the soil. When the soil gets depleted, so will the plants. Traditional sources of magnesium don't have as much as they used to. Magnesium is difficult to measure accurately but red blood cell magnesium is considered the best test. Cheap. Most people find they're low. Apparently symptoms are also a good measure. My symptoms were heart arrhythmia and horrid leg cramps. They're gone since I boosted magnesium.

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Randall Stoehr's avatar

David, I as well often (once or twice a week) can experience lower leg blasts of cramping in the middle of the night. mostly after a stout leg day workout of barbell squats. My son is a power lifter and knows a bunch about long muscle fiber fatigue.

So we had been comparing notes one day and he thought I was lack in post leg cramp hydration and suggested creatine monohydrate. So now when that quick and alarming sensation of an involuntary response into pain shows up. I get out of bed and have a tiny spoon full in cold water. Within minutes the pulling is gone and I can return to bed and sleep well again. It beats walking it off till it subsides. Try it out.

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pretty-red, old guy's avatar

excellent. Will tell wife.

Middle of the night I am up running to get the "pickle Juice." to do the same thing! Wonder if ingredients similar?!

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DC Lovell's avatar

Good point on soils minerals and plants. Would be great if prior to claims these products were analyzed. Great to hear Mg had a positive impact for you.

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David Watson's avatar

The most accurate analysis seems to be a blood test. Even if the labels are correct, different people utilize the nutrients a little differently, as I discovered with my oxalate overload depleting my available mg.

By the way, if you get too much, it can't get absorbed and gets into the large intestine and causes diarhea. Hard stools are a sign of deficiency. It also supports restful sleep. If you don't sleep well you might be deficient. Pretty important mineral.

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